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The presidents continued consultations at a working lunch.

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President of Russia Vladimir Putin: Mr Lukashenko,

Thank you for coming in time for Cosmonautics Day, especially because we have a major event – our cosmonauts, including the first female cosmonaut from Belarus returned safely to earth.

We have another good event – our new heavy missile flew from a new spaceport. This is yet another stage in the development of the space industry in Russia.

And, of course, in addition to all other things, we have something to discuss. I am referring to our economic ties that are making steady headway. Last year, we demonstrated good economic growth rates and now everything is on the upsurge.

Overall, we see even bigger growth in the first months of the current year than we had in the past year. We are developing diversification, cooperation and interoperability. So, everything is on the upsurge and we are very happy about this.

Naturally, we will talk about security issues in the western borders of both Belarus and Russia. I know that you have information on everything taking place in Ukraine. Nevertheless, I will certainly use your visit to tell you in detail about what is going on.

In general, as you know, we have never rejected a peaceful settlement of disputes. Moreover, this is what we were inclined to do. It was not Russia that started this war in 2014. Everything began with a coup d’etat in Ukraine. Later, when everything moved to a hot phase, you initiated the conduct of peace negotiations in Belarus. We launched them in two cities.

Later, the negotiating teams moved to Turkey, to Istanbul.

We largely completed this work there, which took us much time and effort. We initialed it on both sides. Ukraine also initialed it. This paper, this document was initialed.

As you know, later, under pressure from the West, the Ukrainian side opted out of these agreements. I would like to remind you that at the time we were told that we could not sign the document in this manner, that Ukraine could not sign the document “with a gun to its head,” that we had to withdraw our troops from Kiev. So we did. Immediately after we did that, our agreements were discarded.

Now, as you know, the idea of holding some kind of conference in Switzerland is being promoted. We are not invited there. Moreover, they think that we have nothing to do there, and at the same time they say that nothing can be solved without us. Since we are not going there (it has now turned into a kind of nonsense), they say that we refuse to negotiate. We were not invited, but they say that we refuse.

It would be funny if it were not so sad. Once again, I would like to emphasise that we are in favour of talks. But not in the format of being imposed any schemes that have nothing to do with reality. Why do I say that? Because if the need arises, I will allow myself to turn to you, and maybe we will continue consultations with you in this area.

As for other matters, you are also well aware that, unfortunately, we have recently seen a series of strikes on our energy facilities, and we had to respond. I would like to emphasise that in winter time, guided by humanitarian considerations, we did not launch any strikes on energy facilities. I mean, they wanted to have our social institutions, hospitals and so on left without power supply. But after a series of strikes on our energy facilities, we had to respond.

I repeat once again: if everything gets down to solving the issues we talked about from the outset, and in the energy sector they are related, among other things, to solving one of the tasks that we set for ourselves, which is demilitarisation… Above all, we proceed from the fact that in this way we directly impact the military-industrial complex of Ukraine. But if we do get to the point where I started, if we move on to talks about resolving all the issues in other ways, then of course, as I have already said many times, we are ready for that.

You and I will talk about it in greater detail, I will tell you everything in detail.

President of the Republic of Belarus Alexander Lukashenko: Mr Putin, thank you for your updates. I can confirm everything you have said, because you and I revisited these issues on numerous occasions – a year ago, and several months ago – and discussed them, including the peace settlement. They are planning to hold what they call a peace conference in Switzerland. But if they want to talk about peace in Ukraine without us, let them do it.

Once again, we believe that the only thing they can agree on there is how to intensify the escalation of this conflict. Without Russia, what peace process are we talking about? No peace settlement is possible without Russia.

Maybe they are right in choosing not to invite us, because there is actually nothing to talk to them about when they try to invite more than 100 states and dictate something to us or enforce something on us. This does not sound like a proposal for peace talks.

Vladimir Putin: I think they – or at least the opposite side – has driven itself into a corner, to a certain extent, by refusing to negotiate, expecting to defeat Russia on the battlefield, to inflict a strategic defeat on Russia. Now, having understood that this is impossible and having refused to negotiate, they have found themselves in a predicament.

Alexander Lukashenko: Indeed, they have found an ingenious way out.

Vladimir Putin: But our goal is not putting everyone in a tough spot. Just the opposite: we are ready for constructive efforts. But clearly, nothing detached from reality can be imposed on us.

Alexander Lukashenko: What I wanted to say is that I wholeheartedly support, absolutely wholeheartedly, the Russian authorities and you personally when it comes to the peace process in this conflict.

There are all the conditions for sitting down and negotiating the issue. If they do not want it, the reason is clear to us; we have answered that question. If those across the ocean choose to talk about peace, Ukraine will hear their voice. Ukrainians should know, especially the ordinary people, that the issue does not depend on us. Speaking plainly, the ball is in their court.

I remember the process that began in Belarus. We hosted three rounds of talks, and the fourth round was held in Istanbul. You later sent the photocopies to me. First you showed me the document, which I read, and then you forwarded the copy to me, just as we had agreed. It was the initialled document. It registered major concessions from both Russians and Ukrainians. And then a visitor called them [Ukrainians] down and ordered them to keep fighting to the last Ukrainian.

In other words, we wholeheartedly support the peace process, which Russia never refused to discuss, including today.

If we can contribute to this, you are aware of our capabilities. We will always stand together and act in the same spirit as you.

Thank you for the space mission. It is clear that it would not be held without your decision. We agreed that we would send a Belarusian woman.

Vladimir Putin: It was you who suggested it.

Alexander Lukashenko: Yes, we selected six out of the more than 2,000 candidates, and then narrowed it down to two, the primary cosmonaut and the backup. Today she received a state decoration, just as you do it in Russia, and she has become a Hero of Belarus.

We have reached an agreement with Roscosmos, with [Director General] Yury Borisov, that they would gladly work with us to further develop the space programme. We would like to orbit one more satellite with a resolution of 25 centimetres in the future, possibly in two years, jointly with our Russian colleagues. It will be a strong statement. We are working on it. There is no doubt that we will do it together with Russia. We will also work together on the cosmonaut training programme.

We are ready to join your programme, what Russian cosmonauts are doing. There is no need to have separate Belarusian or Russian programmes.

Vladimir Putin: We will work together.

Alexander Lukashenko: Yes. You have made significant progress. We have people, both men and women, who are ready to fly. We have not seen any rejection from Roscosmos. If you support this, there is another young woman, who was a backup – we have invested a lot of money in her training. If there is a need and if you make this decision, she will be ready to continue working and training with the cosmonauts.

Thank you for your support with sea shipments. We are working and looking at other ports. Russian ports help us ship goods. In short, there are no cases where goods would be stacked on the shore of the ocean or sea, and we would have no capacity to ship them. We cooperate with St Petersburg and Murmansk, as well as ports in the Far East.

Vladimir Putin: The northern option certainly has great potential.

Alexander Lukashenko: It is very interesting. The Northern Sea Route – we have actually supplied goods along the Northern Sea Route. Without ports in Murmansk, we have already delivered several thousand tonnes. It is very convenient for our manufacturers, so your support was very important and relevant for us.

To be honest, we have already exchanged views on certain economic issues. You supported my plan for our prime ministers to meet on April 15 and discuss the economic issues that need to be addressed. This is very important for us.

As for energy and the strikes, I remember our earlier conversation about people in Russia expressing dissatisfaction and saying Russia needed to target sensitive spots such as energy infrastructure. At that time, you said something unexpected in a war context: “You know, I feel sorry for the people – the kids in kindergartens, at schools. If the energy sector in Ukraine collapses, children, people will suffer.”

But these strikes at sensitive points in Russia call for an appropriate response.

So again, I think there are a lot of insane people in Ukraine, but not all of them. I think they have heard it and seen it. I think that there will be some kind of rollback in this regard.

As it is, they are simply provoking Russia to carry out such strikes. In this case, I cannot be deeply immersed in this conflict, I cannot support or justify Ukraine. Not in the slightest. It would be wrong to do this and fuel this escalation, because summer is short, and then winter comes, and that is dangerous.

Mr Putin, I believe – and my instincts have never failed me – that your initiatives for a peaceful settlement of the conflict will find a response in Ukraine. They will. Strange as it may seem, they will draw a response among the military. I am ready to stand shoulder to shoulder with you and work towards this goal.

Reporters have asked me some questions, including about Ukraine and the need to rush, that Russia urgently needs to go and talk to someone. Your journalists have asked me just now. No, there is no need to rush or talk to anyone; you just need to behave like a human being. Take the document that you once showed me, put it on the table and negotiate.

Vladimir Putin: Yes, and work with that document.

Alexander Lukashenko: This is a reasonable approach. It includes acceptable terms for Ukraine as well. They have agreed with that.

Vladimir Putin: They have agreed. Of course.

Alexander Lukashenko: Therefore, I think we will have an extensive discussion on these issues as well.

Vladimir Putin: Good. Thank you.

What is the situation on your western borders?

Alexander Lukashenko: The situation is difficult. I am surprised and most of all disturbed – and I am speaking about this – by the Polish leaders’ policy. Why do they need this confrontation? Both the Lithuanians and Latvians are throwing dozens of dead bodies across the border. Migrants head down there – they have built a fence – so, they throw them over the fence to our side of the border. Now that the snow has melted, the corpses are exposed, –lying scattered right on the border strip. There are people from Afghanistan, Iran, Africa… Why kill people and throw them away in such a barbaric manner? This creates tensions.

They have closed the border for both us and you. It is very hard to do any work. Even the Chinese and the Kazakhs find it hard to work with the Poles and others. There are huge lines on the border. They are doing this on purpose. We have not closed the border with them. You know that we have visa-free neighbours, but they do not let their people travel to [Belarus] for fear that we will recruit them. As a specialist, you might have recruited quite a few people, but certainly not by seizing people right on the border and recruiting them there. If we need to recruit someone, we will use different methods. But nevertheless…

The Lithuanians are particularly tough. They are holding [military] exercises and are planning to stage more drills in May. We are standing head-to-head with them on the border. They have redeployed Americans, Germans… Surprisingly, the lesson has not done them any good. They have redeployed battalions to Lithuania and to Poland. Of course, we had to deploy our own units and put them in position against them.

I do not know why they need this. We are not going to wage war anywhere. They are shouting that Lukashenko and Putin will overrun Europe tomorrow. We have never even discussed such plans to conquer someone. We have enough problems of our own and conquering anyone is the last thing we want.

Vladimir Putin: It is the ruling circles that need this nonsense in order to explain and justify their spending on the war in Ukraine. That is all there is to it.

Alexander Lukashenko: Absolutely. And their inadequacy on top of it.

Vladimir Putin: Yes. The spending, primarily the spending. This is the main reason why this topic is being blown out of all proportion. Some aggressive policy of Russia’s… This is the main thing. There are no other reasons.

Alexander Lukashenko: As it is, it is tolerable.

We have coped with the sanctions and economic pressure, like Russia has. If we provide the huge Belarusian-Russian market with supplies and also work with the friendly countries, both you and us will have more than enough on our hands. So, we will hold out. We have the market, we have the resources. We can do it. We know what needs to be done. The loans that have been issued for our joint projects with the Russian Federation – 100 billion – if you remember…

Vladimir Putin: Yes, I do.

Alexander Lukashenko: Eighty-odd billion have already…

Vladimir Putin: For industrial production.

Alexander Lukashenko: Yes, yes, joint projects. So, 81 billion… The projects are beginning to work; we are building industrial plants, and so on.

We were worried about chips, microchips, and other things. We are getting by and starting to develop our own production. I think we will easily cope with this situation.

Therefore, as I said once, much time is needed, but we will solve the problems that we must solve together with Russia. One would like to have the Ukrainians with us. I believe, I feel that the moment is not far off when Ukraine comes to its senses and realises where its fortune lies.

Vladimir Putin: Let them make their own decisions.

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